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MasterChief
 #1 
Hi ive just registered just ive been reading for a while. I wanted to ask if anyone has tried cannabis to help with tinnitus? Im having awful awful problems sleeping, and ive read some people get good relief from it?

Any have any experience? For the record, im not interested in knee-jerk drugs are bad mkay responses, ATM im neutral either way on cannabis untill i can form an opinion. Thanks.
DrNagler
 #2 
Welcome, MC!

I am aware of one well-documented published case report in which cannabis was helpful in tinnitus, but the tinnitus in this instance was due to a condition known as pseudotumor cerebri (benign intracanial hypertension), and THC purportedly decreases intracranial hypertension.  When considering all causes of tinnitus, pseudotumor cerebri is only very rarely a factor (much less than 1%), so for all practical purposes I would pretty much discount this anecdotal report.  Anyway, here is the citing:

Raby WN, Modica PA, Wolintz RJ, Murtaugh K. Dronabinol reduces signs and symptoms of idiopathic intracranial hypertension: a case report. J Ocul Pharmacol Ther 2006;22(1):68-75

smn
Thatch
 #3 

i've heard of some tinnitus sufferers using cannibus just for a sleeping aid, but not for relief from the actual tinnitus

MasterChief
 #4 
Id be willing to take it just for the sleeping thing. I cant subsist on zopiclone forever. Theres no way i can sleep with my adrenal land jammed wide open by tinnitus and my limbic system going haywire, its biologically impossible, as it should be. So if some weed turns that off, its helpful right? Even if it oesent affect my T volmume per se?

Interesting thing, i believe tinitus volume (perceivd or otherwise its the same thing) is a function of stress and reaction, but i also know the volume, pitch etc can eally change on its own. I was lying in be last night wracked by it as it got so loud, stress thru the roof. Suddenly my ear 'popped' or exploded or whatever you call it, and rang terribly for a minuite, my stress went thru the roof an my heart nearly jumped out of my chest, panic attack started kcking in. Then it faded and was much quieter than before. I took this as an amazing blessing and went to sleep. It reduced by a factor of atleast 10 even though i was in high distress, all on its own. Its not as simple as our perceptions of it.
Micky
 #5 
Master chef said in part ..
=================================
Suddenly my ear 'popped' or exploded or whatever you call it, and rang terribly for a minuite, my stress went thru the roof an my heart nearly jumped out of my chest, panic attack started kcking in. Then it faded and was much quieter than before. I took this as an amazing blessing and went to sleep. It reduced by a factor of atleast 10 even though i was in high distress, all on its own. Its not as simple as our perceptions of it.

===================================
I think when this happens, your brain is trying to re-set the tinnitus to how it was before you had tinnitus, it may also be the reason why we have good and bad days..just my theory..lets hope one day it succeeds and silence prevails ..Micky ..

 
DrNagler
 #6 
MC posted:

Id be willing to take [cannabis] just for the sleeping thing.

................

A discussion of the pros and cons of cannabis is above my pay grade!

.................

I cant subsist on zopiclone forever.

................

May I ask why?

.................

Theres no way i can sleep with my adrenal land jammed wide open by tinnitus and my limbic system going haywire, its biologically impossible, as it should be.

................

I understand what you are saying, but I disagree with your premise.  It's not your tinnitus that is determining your adrenal and limbic activity.

.................

So if some weed turns that off, its helpful right?

...............

So you are saying that you can't subsist on zopiclone forever, but you can subsist on cannabis forever?

smn

MasterChief
 #7 
I cant use zopiclne forever as 1. i cant get an infinate supply of it, because it can do bad things to you long term ive read, thats why they wont prescribe me more thn 7 at a time and 2. it just stoppes working eventually. Ive already exprienced that.

And i know i cant subsist on cannabis forever, but im i such a tight spot here i dont know what else to do. If i think more than a month into the future i become suicidal. Id really rather not smoke it if i could help it but whatelse do i do?

Sorry my spelling is bad, i can sell but my keyboard isnt very good.
MasterChief
 #8 

and as for as i know it is the tinnitus determining limbic activity. There are deep links between the audiory cortex and the limbic system, and anything flagged as a threat is sent to the limbic to produce an emotional response, adrenaline is a side effect of this, the point being to make u remove yourself from the threat. Its working as it should, but for a very wrong reason. Its a problem coswe dont have concious control over such base subsystems of the brain. As far as i know?

painterdude
 #9 

Are you telling me that no one smokes grass on this board?  Maybe that's why I never got T when I was younger.  Hey Dr. Nagler...different generation than back in our time huh?  Not implying that you partook, but the odds are that there has to be a head amoung all those who looked at this post.  Back in our day, maybe folks were not afraid to admit it...or maybe it was just the people I knew, ya know, the stoners, the honor students, the jocks.  pd

DrNagler
 #10 
MC posted:

and as for as i know it is the tinnitus determining limbic activity. There are deep links between the audiory cortex and the limbic system, and anything flagged as a threat is sent to the limbic to produce an emotional response, adrenaline is a side effect of this, the point being to make u remove yourself from the threat. Its working as it should, but for a very wrong reason. Its a problem coswe dont have concious control over such base subsystems of the brain.

............

As I see it, the primary determinant of your limbic and autonomic activity is not your tinnitus - it is your response to your tinnitus.  And while I agree that you do not have direct conscious control over your response to your tinnitus, you do have the ability to indirectly modify your response to your tinnitus over time.

smn
DrNagler
 #11 
PD posted:

Are you telling me that no one smokes grass on this board?  Maybe that's why I never got T when I was younger.  Hey Dr. Nagler...different generation than back in our time huh?  Not implying that you partook, but the odds are that there has to be a head amoung all those who looked at this post.

..........

Maybe the reason a discussion of the pros and cons of cannabis is above my pay grade is that I fried that part of my brain while a college student in the late 60's? 

smn
CPW151
 #12 
Maybe the reason a discussion of the pros and cons of cannabis is above my pay grade is that I fried that part of my brain while a college student in the late 60's? 

smn

 
Yea, sure - still had enough brain power to become an MD and surgeon.  As for the limbic system, which I think controls the emotional responses, is it not possible for us to learn to control the limbic system intentionally to some extent?  I know people who can control their heart rate (bio-feedback) BP and other things that are "normally" beyond our control.  Is this not in part what we are trying to do with various tinnitus treatments?  Neuromonics certainly advertises that their device works directly on the limbic system.  So if we can learn to control HR and BP why can't we learn to control the limbic system - or is that what we are all on this board trying to do?  Learning to control any negative responses to tinnitus?  How far off am I Dr. N?

CPW
MasterChief
 #13 

DrNagler, your post about the limbic system confuses me. AFAIK, your response to T doesent control your limbic system, because your limbic system IS the response to T.

MasterChief
 #14 
Anyway back on topic, About the cannabis.

Anyone have epereinces they want to contribute?
Thatch
 #15 
I used to smoke back in the day, and from that experience i can say that i never had troubles sleeping, but then again i never had to experience that while suffering from T.
I couldnt smoke it even if i wanted to now, im a paramedic and were subjected to drug screenings and potential polygraphs.. so unless theres a day where a GP can write a script for medicinal uses i can cross that method off the list
DrNagler
 #16 
MC posted:

DrNagler, your post about the limbic system confuses me. AFAIK, your response to T doesent control your limbic system, because your limbic system IS the response to T.

.........

You are right, MC.  My wording was poor and misleading.

What I wanted to convey is that the response to tinnitus, which is largely dictated by the limbic system, the autonomic nervous system, and their interaction, can be significantly impacted - although typically not by consciously "trying" to do it.

smn


DrNagler
 #17 
CPW posted:

As for the limbic system, which I think controls the emotional responses, is it not possible for us to learn to control the limbic system intentionally to some extent?

..........

Well, you can make a conscious decision to do something about your tinnitus instead of being miserable.  But a person who is truly suffering from severe intrustive tinnitus is apt to be sorely disappointed if he or she tries to use the direct "think happy thoughts" approach to obtain lasting relief.  As I see it lasting changes generally require more of an indirect approach to modification of the involved subconscious pathways.

smn
CPW151
 #18 
Well, you can make a conscious decision to do something about your tinnitus instead of being miserable.  But a person who is truly suffering from severe intrustive tinnitus is apt to be sorely disappointed if he or she tries to use the direct "think happy thoughts" approach to obtain lasting relief.  As I see it lasting changes generally require more of an indirect approach to modification of the involved subconscious pathways.

smn

 
Dr. Nagler, Don't think I asked the question right from the response you gave.  I agree totally that you have to "do" something instead of being miserable.  Which is why I suggested bio-feedback as an example of doing something to make physiological changes, although perhaps not tinnitus.   And I agree that thinking "happy thoughts" will also bring disappointment.  And I agree that lasting changes requires more indirect approaches, i.e. CBT, TRT, Neuromonics (?).  My question was simply, if the emotional responses are in the limbic system, are we not trying to modify those subconscious pathways or the emotional responses in the limbic system?   That was all I was really asking.  Showing my ignorance again I guess which isn't hard for me to do sometimes.

CPW 


DrNagler
 #19 
CPW posted:

My question was simply, if the emotional responses are in the limbic system, are we not trying to modify those subconscious pathways or the emotional responses in the limbic system?

..........

Yes, that's what we are trying to do ... along with trying to modify the autonomic functions that are intimately involved with the emotional responses in tinnitus.

smn
jerry
 #20 
MasterChief,

I don't use weed for sleep, Lunesta takes care of that. I do fire up a "fatty" on a day after work when I'm at an 8 plus on the T scale. It dosen't take the T away but it sure takes me to a happier place. I'm not a pot head, I smoke about an ounce or less a year. At 50 years old and invasive tinnitus for the last 10 years, tried all the legal drugs, pink noise, maskers, holistic, and acupuncture, nothing worked, so what the hell, if a couple of hits on a joint makes me feel good, so be it!
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